Photo by The Rocketeer, shared via
Flickr.
We haven't been on the best of terms with
Alicia Voorhies since we
reported on the presence of bisphenol-A in Sassy products many (including us) had previously reported as BPA-free. At the time, we thought it would be unfair to point out that these items were on sale at Alicia's "BPA-free" shop,
The Soft Landing, although several of our readers did, with much frustration. Alicia responded to the issue by posting about the issue on her store's blog without crediting the source of the information. Fair enough, I suppose.
Today's missive from the Soft Landing, entitled "Nuby Responds to Incorrect Materials Listing In ZRecs Guide," finds Alicia in top form. In it, Alicia scoops the universe by revealing that the
ZRecs Guide contained "incorrect" information about the status of Nuby pacifiers and teethers in regards to PVC (not phthalates).
Here's what actually happened:
- In April 2008, we asked a top-level executive at Nuby the following via email in response to a BPA product spreadsheet he sent us: "Thank you for the spreadsheet. Can you also identify which, if any, of these products have phthalates or PVC in them?" He responded that none of their products contained phthalates, and that they had been phthalate-free for some time.
- In June, we contacted the company's customer service department, asking them the following: "I'm interested in learning which of your products (bottles, feeding, teethers, toys, pacifiers) do not contain BPA, PVC and/or phthalates. Do you have a list?" We received a list of BPA-free products in response, which made no mention of phthalates or PVC.
- On October 2, 2008, we launched the ZRecs Guide, which included listings for Nuby's teethers and pacifiers, rated as possibly containing PVC (with a rating of "low" or "medium" confidence, depending on the product) along with the following statement in each listing's notes: "Nuby has not responded to a ZRecs request for information regarding PVC content in their teethers."
- On November 6, 2008, we wrote this representative back: "Do you have an updated list? We're trying to confirm the accuracy of the information in our ZRecs Guide for Safer Children's Products. You can see the Nuby/Luv 'n Care listing here [link to all Nuby listings inserted]. Thanks for any help you can give in distributing accurate information to our readers." We received a new list, again lacking any PVC or phthalates information.
- Today, the top-level Nuby executive contacted us to inform us that a customer had alerted him to the statements, and told us that all Nuby products are PVC-free.
Jenni then spoke to the Nuby executive on the phone and explained how the ZRecs Guide works - that we categorize products based on chemicals they may contain, with our relative level of confidence displayed prominently in the listings; that we work from the information we are provided with, which we work very hard to get; and that we track more than 1,000 products by around 150 companies, so asking for the same information on three different occasions was about our limit. We explained that companies often avoid answering our direct questions, sometimes quite ingeniously, and that in the absence of clear company statements we err on the side of caution in our ratings to help parents avoid products that may contain chemicals.
In other words, there was nothing "incorrect" about the statements we had made - we had asked, repeatedly, for information, and in its absence we felt it our duty to warn consumers that the products might contain a substance some (but not all) wish to avoid, allowing them to make informed decisions based on the best information we could get.
The executive explained that he had never heard of PVC (rather than phthalates specifically) being a concern among parents, so he had thought that stating that their products were phthalate-free was "the same as" saying they were PVC-free. Jenni explained that PVC can in fact be made without phthalates, and discussed some of our readers' concerns about the environmental impact of PVC with him.
The conversation ended amicably, with us agreeing to update the information this weekend and with the executive welcoming us to call on him again when we next update our Nuby product information. He also stated that he or one of his representatives would now look through the Guide and let us know if there was any other information in need of updating, as Nuby's extensive product line can be confusing.
We will continue to update and enhance the
ZRecs Guide in good faith and with malice towards none.
I am disappointed in SL and commented so. I follow both of your blogs as I like how comprehensive your findings are and that you cover other things like toys and clothing and make it mroe personal by throwing in family posts. The information that both you and SL provide is invaluable to me as a mom and I am very thankful. I am disappointed to see SL turn this into Blog vs Blog. If she were truly comited to the cause she would have merely just updated the info or even better contacted you ia e-mail. It make more sense to have amicable relatons with those comitted to the same cause.
I agree with Carrie. I, too, am disappointed in Soft Landing! I follow both blogs and received the “alert” in my email inbox and thought the missive scooping Z recs was written with ill will and poor taste.
Agreed. There was nothing wrong with you erring on the side of caution. Lately I’ve seen a lot of safe & green blogs showing a lot of pique at other blogs or at comments from their very readers. We’re all on the same side as wanting safe products for our kids, so there should be a little more professionalism & less snarky emotion to be the one who is “right”.
Part of why I like your blog is that you provide unbiased findings because you don’t sell products mentioned. I see more of a conflict of interest with the Soft Landing since she sells the items - that’s probably why she got so cutting so fast - her bottom line was threatened.
I trust you guys. You have given the company ample opportunity to come clean on its products. To not know about PVC concerns just sounds a little fishy to me, but who knows. When there are so many other choices that you can be 100% sure about, I would not even consider Nuby.
I went to The Soft Landing to read what she said. I didn’t find it as offensive as I thought it would be; just thought it would be a lot worse.
Maybe everyone isn’t aware that ZRecs is an Amazon.com affiliate so he is making money selling these products. I don’t have a problem with that because many blogs do the same thing.
I’ll continue to follow both blogs.
Thanks for chiming in, everyone. It’s nice to hear that we aren’t alone in our feelings about this.
GK, you make a good point. We have actually been planning some changes in relation to that position which I think will help clarify our values on this. We agree there isn’t anything wrong with anyone making a profit by sharing this kind of information - it supports our work! - and I personally don’t think it affects our objectivity. But we will be making some changes nonetheless.
More on that to come next month. It’s news we’ll be proud to announce.
Honestly, after reading both blog posts (Soft Landing & ZRecs), it just seems like both of you are trying to get the corner on the market and neither or you are truly concerned about the chemicals in children’s products. I’m really disappointed in both, it all seems VERY childish.
Well, Becca, we struggled with the question of whether to even respond. But we’ve tried not responding to attacks on our credibility before, and it feels worse.
I wonder if there is any response we could have offered that would have felt appropriate to you. We could have taken a sunny, “gee, thanks!” approach, I suppose, but it wouldn’t have been true to our frustration over her tactics.
If you believe we are not “truly concerned,” I’m not sure why you bother reading our blogs at all. If you can’t trust us to tell you about chemical issues, I’m not sure why you’d trust our recommendations on toys, baby gear, or parenting issues. Or maybe you don’t, and just stepped up to comment here.
Either way, sorry to have disappointed you. It’s a rare flare-up in an otherwise quite amicable community.
J, I *count* on you being truly concerned and I believe you are. Thank you for your work.
Jeremiah,
I know you won’t post this (as past experience dictates) because you only have the ability to show one side of an issue, so I guess this has to be just for you...You clearly have no idea what you’ve done to yourself by presenting misinformation about Nuby (and not to mention The Soft Landing). It’s sad really. You’re surely old enough to realize what you do (especially those things you already know are counterfeit) always comes back to you. If you’d conduct yourself in an upstanding, truly good manner, you might be surprised what benefits come your way. It’s almost unbelievable that you think you can post whatever you want about whoever you want (truth or fiction) and get away with it. I’m sure the ladies at The Soft Landing are laughing at your attempts to smear their names (and so am I) because they know this simple truth in life...You get what you give. I have to admit to almost feeling sorry for you though since you don’t have this basic concept. You’d really do yourself and your family some good to learn it (or at least try). I know one thing for sure...The Soft Landing team conducts themselves with the utmost integrity and responsibility (I know this from past experiences with them). We’ll see who comes out on the good side of things...Of course it’ll be Alicia and her business. Then maybe you’ll be able to open your eyes to the light of doing good, responsible work (although with your past actions and strong-living denial I’d doubt it). Feel free to respond to me via this blog post or at my email above...I’d love nothing more than to hear back from you :)
Best, Beth
I am a bit confused as to timelines, accusations, and tones of messages, but I believe that both sites are working toward putting together information that parents can use to make informed purchases. Since the companies are confused, deviant, oblivious, negligent, or some combination of the aforementioned, it is very hard to discern what is truth. It seems that both sites (ZRecs and SL) are trying to sift through what is out there in a way that ultimately keeps our kids safe as can be.
I follow both of your blogs - as I’m sure most parents like me do as we check and re-check the information on our kids’ products. Both of you seem to be credible sources of information and I for one am grateful for your extensive research as it saves me a lot of time and anxiety! I think, unfortunately, it’s inevitable that you will come up with different and, possibly, contradictory answers from time to time and it’s a shame to see you bickering over it. I don’t see any need for competition between your sites and it’s disappointing to see so much unnecessary focus wasted on it. That being said, I will continue to read both of your blogs regularly (as I’m sure the others like me will do!) so this little quarrel really hasn’t changed anything for either of you.
Beth, curious to know what misinformation you’re finding. The source and meaning of our ratings are explained pretty clearly (we hope) here.
That said, we typically let invective in comments stand, as long as it’s aimed solely at us. The deleted comment I assume you’re referring to was a generic pitch for the Soft Landing submitted to an unrelated post. We delete any and all off-topic pitches for any business or product, from any post. These and other policies of our blog network are provided for readers here.
To address the content of your previously deleted comment (which asked why we don’t “have any information on our site about The Soft Landing"), our blog is focused on products themselves, not retailers of those products, so it’s a question you could ask (with equal irrelevance) about many other online retailers of children’s products.
We do have some retailers we recommend and others we do not go out of our way to endorse. These decisions are based on nothing more sinister than the claims they make about products they sell, their pricing, and other policies that are relevant to our readers.
Wow! I love you guys here at ZRecs. I trust all the information you have posted, and saved me the time from finding out myself. All these mean spirited comments I think are completely unnecessary. You have worked hard for parents like me and I truly appreciate what you’ve done. I’m not sure why SL did what it did, but for now I will be sticking with you!
ZRecs Guide: I think that there is nothing wrong with what Alicia wrote. I don’t find it to be in a negative tone but rather just reporting. I am reading comments here at your site and Alicia and I think that the readers are fueling flames that are cold. Readers that are more devote to you or Alicia are getting defensive of their “favorite” site. Honestly, they are feeling defensive because after reading your comment, I think anyone that is a fan of just your site would feel they should be defending you. I got the tone that Alicia had done something horrible and was very rude, just by your title alone. I was shocked so I jumped over there but I DID NOT understand what you were saying or how you were getting that interpretation.
I think perhaps, it did upset you as authors working hard to report to parent, understandably so. However, what is that Alicia said that is wrong? You did take the side of caution and based on what you believed to be the truth based on your findings and reports.
Both of your guides are trusted by me and recommended by Green and Clean Mom. I read both of your sites. I think that you both have a niche you need to fill and protect and there is nothing wrong with that. I also believe that you both have tough jobs trying to deal with companies and be a resource for moms trying to buy safe products. I point to both of your sites and respect what you both do.
I just think it is too bad readers and parents have to pick one site or the other to trust or read over this because of what some consider “mean spirited” comments. It would do all parent some good know they can come to both sites for information.
Well said Sommer
I have to say, this seems catty and unnecessary.
Sorry to hear that, Natasha. We have a long history of working on these issues and believe in defending our work. Hope to see you again - we love what you’re doing with Creative Narrations.
Hmm...it seems every other week you are calling someone out for stepping on your toes or not giving you credit you think it due you somehow. It is getting a little old. I for one love Alicia and was VERY dissapointed to be reading this drama here. I think someone needs to tone down the ego a notch or two.
Thanks to everyone for sharing your views. We think there may be some confusion about how the ZRecs Guide ratings and confidence levels work and we’ll be posting on that in the very near future. We’re closing comments on this post now.